Kin and Marginalized groups (again)

fromfiction:

I’ve been thinking a lot about the question of kin and marginalized groups lately, because it keeps coming up, and I think I’ve finally come to an understanding about the whole issue.

If you’re not a member of a marginalized group, you shouldn’t try to speak for members of that group. Ever. That includes telling others what is and isn’t offensive to these groups.

And if you are a member of a marginalized group, that still doesn’t give you the right to speak for all members of that group on matters that are not under a consensus. Yes, you are the authority on what is harmful and offensive to you, and you have every right to be offended by whatever behavior offends you. But you don’t have the right to dictate that it’s harmful to all members of that group, unless the group as a whole has expressed that opinion.

You are the authority on what is harmful to you. Put your comfort and safety first by all means, but do not jeopardize the safety of others to do it.

When you ask kin and multiples to change, or get rid of, or silence aspects of themselves that they have no control of, you are asking them to do very real, certain, emotional and psychological harm to themselves, in order to avoid potential harm to others you have decided *might* be at risk.

There is a saying ‘don’t set yourself on fire to keep others warm’, and that is what you are asking them to do. You are asking them to harm themselves to avoid potential harm to others.

When kin and multiples post about their experiences on their own blogs, and in generic kin tags, they are not automatically doing harm. If you feel harmed by what they are posting, please, by all means block them. Even privately encourage your friends you feel might be harmed by their posts to block them. But do not encourage others to do harm to themselves to keep you safe.


What to do if you see someone who is is kin of a character belonging to a marginalized group that they are not a member of (race, disability, etc):

if you are a member of that marginalized group and you feel offended or harmed:

  • block them so you can’t see their posts and they can’t see yours. Your comfort, mental health, and identity are important!

if you are not a member of that marginalized group and you feel offended:

  • block them so you can’t see their posts and they can’t see yours, and move on. It is none of your business.

What to do if you see someone who is kin of a character belonging to a marginalized group that they are not a member of, and they are attempting to speak for members of that group or invade spaces specifically set out for that group:

  • remind them that they are no longer a member of that group and their behavior is completely unacceptable! 

vagabondwyrm:

What exactly is “divinity”?

Is there (rhetorically speaking) a quantifiable value that makes something “divine” or a “deity”? Or is it simply an abstract concept attributed to beings that are somehow other – older, more powerful, from another plane or energetic wavelength?

Does the power to instill divinity rest upon the worshipers themselves, and not the one deified?

I feel like this was a question I often chewed on, and I doubt it is a question that could be answered across the board. For me, at least, I have settled upon the latter.

I was not a creature that had innate dominion over some force of nature. I was not a great creator, no more than any mortal given eons of practice at a craft. I was not the embodiment of anything – not unless you count being the epitome of an ancient and insufferable know-it-all.

But I do think, more than once, I traveled to a land, and I found myself called a “god.” Or, more regularly, I left and returned some centuries later (either by mistake or design) and found myself deified in my long absence.

By and large, I think I was mostly gently confused by this proclivity. I considered myself more an adviser, a beast of ages and of experience, but… I was also vain. It’s hard to turn down such a compliment.

But also who was I to truly say otherwise? Who am I to deny that belief, that trust in me? It seemed like a great insult, and an unnecessary rejection.

It might have been more responsibility than I had anticipated, but all I could do was make no promises I could not keep. And it wasn’t as if I was lacking in time or interest or ability.

For the most part, I think I was pleased with the arrangements, if still bemused.

Yet I wonder still: where is the line between the long-lived, the immortal, and the divine? And how fine is it, in the end?

Anti-Anti-Otherkin

dovewithscales:

Okay, tired of repeating myself, so I’m going to make a single anti-anti-otherkin post and copy the link when I need it. I will be adding all my counter arguments to this post as they come up.

Hence forth I will expect anti-kin to come up with new material every time they come at me. If they don’t all they’ll get is a link to this.

If I’m forgetting anything, please let me know and I will edit.

WHAT OTHERKIN IS

I’ll start by defining otherkin to the best of my ability, so we’re all on the same page. Otherkin are people who identify as one or more non-human entities in a spiritual or psychological sense. 

See also my post The How and Why of Otherkin.

There are many categories within the otherkin umbrella.

Therians identify as animals which currently exist in this world, as opposed to “fantastic” creatures such as dragons.

Fictionkin identify as creatures or characters from works of fiction. Usually this is explained by means of the Multiverse Theory. Legitimate science (in Quantum Physics) holds that there appear to be an infinite number of parallel universes, and that in theory everything exists somewhere in one universe or another. This would naturally mean that all fictional universes are real somewhere. Fictionkin often believe themselves to be reincarnated from one of these other universes.

There are a number of groups of people often conflated with otherkin, who are not.

Copinglinkers, as defined by @who-is-page are people with a non-human identity (or in some cases, relation) which is consciously created. The creator is able to change and pick who/what they identify as/with as need dictates. This identity can be created by anyone, and thus, is not dictated by one’s mental health, or, who have a consciously created coping mechanism which centers around knowingly, willingly, and actively identifying as (or in some cases, with) the user’s choice of a non-human entity.

Copinglinkers ARE NOT OTHERKIN, though they are similar, and may or may not be considered part of the community. It is of course possible for someone to be both.

Factkin are people who identify as a real person. Usually, someone who is still alive. Less commonly, they identify as someone who is dead, which is just what reincarnation is. Factkin ARE NOT OTHERKIN. They also, in this dragon’s opinion, don’t make any sense and are disrespectful both of the real people they identify as, and the otherkin community.

Dissociative disorders are also wrongly conflated with otherkin. The American Psychiatric Association has explicitly addressed this issue. 

OTHERKIN AND MENTAL HEALTH

The Diagnostic and Statistics Manual (DSM) is the definitive manual for diagnosis of mental illness, used by the APA. It literally contains the official definitions of all documented mental illnesses.

The section labeled “Identity Disorder” in the third edition was changed to “Identity Problem” with the release of the DSM-IV in 1952 because they were considered less significant, not worthy of the name disorder and usually not clinically relevant. In 2013 with the DSM-V, the section was removed entirely. Atypical identities are considered harmless, and so common as to be considered normal. This includes otherkin.

Furthermore, the diagnostic criteria for almost all mental illnesses includes that in order for a condition to be considered an illness it must either cause the individual emotional distress, or significantly impair their ability to function normally.

Dissociative Disorders, as opposed the imaginary “identity disorders” which people who are stuck in the 1950′s reference, require that one be dissociative, which is a very specific clinical phenomenon not typically present in otherkin.

Clinical Lycanthropy and Cotard Delusion are dissociative disorders in which one is detached from reality and believes one’s self to be literally and physically not human, or not living, respectively. These bear no resemblance to otherkin. In fact, I shall include a quote from an expert on that subject:

“As regards the existence of [otherkin] communities, online or otherwise, where like-minded people join each other to exchange experiences and ideas on their affinity with animal or supernatural identities, I can only say that we cannot have enough of those groups. Human experience and behaviour is so diverse, and only so little of it tends to be presented as ‘normal’ in the media, that communities such as these should be embraced and encouraged by us all. In my area of expertise, i.e., psychotic disorders, it is well-known that some 10–15 percent of all people in the general population experience auditory hallucinations, and that close to a full 100 percent experience some sort of hallucination during their lives (i.e., auditory, visual, olfactory, or otherwise), but that only 1 percent are diagnosed as suffering from schizophrenia spectrum disorder.”
— Dr. Jan Dirk Blom, expert in clinical lycanthropy , “Understanding the Otherkin.” The Daily Dot, Feb. 22nd 2015.

In short, according to

69,783

people with PhD’s, if you are otherkin, fictionkin, or anything else, and also have a job, normal relationships, housing, and food; you’re not mentally ill.

Calling it mental illness is factually incorrect. Telling people to stop engaging in healthy aspects of normal personality is both stupid and abusive. But please, my dear anti-kin, if you wish to suggest that you know better than the entire APA, keep digging that hole and humiliate yourselves further.

OTHERKIN AND SPIRITUALITY

In a majority of cases, otherkinity is a spiritual belief, no different from any other. It is a variation on reincarnation, and one with a tremendous history. While the term only dates to the 90s, the community dates to the 50s and the concept is ancient. The Celtic bard Taliesin was what we now call otherkin.

As a spiritual belief, one absolutely cannot say with any certainty whether or not these experiences are real, and they do not require proof or evidence. Belief in sufficient.

WHO OTHERKIN ARE

The median age of otherkin appears to be somewhere in the early 20′s. We are most certainly not all teenagers. We are also not mentally ill, or “just using this as a coping mechanism”. I know numerous kin who are successful professionals or college students.

I am an ordained minister with a pagan church, founder of an internationally known non-profit organization, and I work as an editor. I used to conduct workshops for businesses and non-profits on gender inclusion practices, and educational panels on gender identity for psychology graduate classes. I am still friends with a psychology professor at a local college.

In short, we’re competent adults who who what we’re about.

OTHERKIN AND TRANSGENDERISM

Now and then I hear some bullshit about this subject.

As someone who is both transgender and otherkin, there is no real conflict. The issue comes primarily from people who are neither, using fake profiles online and pretending to be one or both, and acting the fool to make us look bad, and then going back to their real identity and holding their own comments up as an example to hurt one or both groups. 

Transgenderism is biologically valid and supported by the medical establishment. Otherkinism is (usually) a spiritual belief, and is also completely validated by the DSM-V.

Do not tell me I have to pretend to be other than I am for your comfort and convenience. That is what gay white men did to trans people (and the rest of the queer community, actually) after Stonewall. Because it was easier for them to gain legitimacy if they ditched the rest of us. I will not have it happen to otherkin.

ON KIN TROLLS

There is a whole style of otherkin hate which involves making a secondary social media account, pretending to be otherkin, posting inflammatory or ridiculous things, and then going back to a main account, and using one’s own made up bullshit as an example to make otherkin look bad.

Otherkin have nothing to do with gender. No one wants their kintype used as a gender. No one wants pronouns based on a kintype. 

Plant kin exist, but they don’t want you to stop mowing the grass, picking flowers, or eating vegetables.

If anyone otherkin has a problem with you eating meat, they’re making vegans look bad, and have nothing to do with kin.

Fact kin may really believe what they’re saying, I don’t know, but they’re not otherkin, so it doesn’t matter.

These are all things which otherkin hating trolls made up, and believing any of it is particularly foolish. Please use a little reason before you go harassing people for what some other asshole said.

therianomalocaris:

victiim-of-changes:

therianomalocaris:

Just so you know, I found out some of my friends were therian/otherkin because I made a crunchy leaf joke and they were like “WAIT ARE YOU OTHERKIN TOO ???”

There’s always a way to find people like you, and most of the time that way is memes.

Are crunchy leaf jokes going to be the ‘kin equivalent of the old “i like your shoelaces/thanks i stole them from the president?” meme now ? Is this how we’ll identify each other in public now? :V

Absolutely, yes. It’s a fact we have to face now. I don’t know if I should laugh or cry knowing it, but then again I have a crunchy leaf icon so I’m not one to talk.

ranthimi:

I get that people with exotrauma shouldn’t necessarily talk about other-life trauma/trauma within a system in spaces that are meant exclusively for people in actively abusive situations or people with exclusively this-life, this-world trauma, but I also think there should be more spaces for people with exotrauma to discuss that and get support because it’s… definitely a thing that definitely sucks and can absolutely hurt just as much as trauma in a more traditional sense. You can do that without invalidating anyone.

Do you guys believe kinning outside of your race is racist?

anti-kin-cringe:

I went to answer this, and thistle practically threw these links at me, so here ya go.

https://anti-kin-cringe.tumblr.com/post/166793352219/can-i-be-kin-with-asian-characters-if-im-white

http://alter-human.tumblr.com/post/145116396395/

http://ampullae.tumblr.com/post/136702262054

https://throwaway276226726.tumblr.com/post/153204508089/

Now if those aren’t enough to give you our stance, well. let me make it clear.
This whole argument assumes a rather dangerous and racist idea, that there is some innate difference between a soul/psyche of a POC, and that of a white person.
-Lazy
ps. Thistle informs me that the bottom two are more for reference if you wanted to learn more about the YBC, and aren’t actually a part of our answer
pps. Why am I doing the work around here, let me sleep

tiarasnteakettles:

tiarasntea-shop:

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antikin: get help ur so delusional GET HELP
otherkin: behold, i have a therapist for unrelated reasons and they disagree with you because otherkin doesn’t fit the definition of a delusion
antikin: uuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuh that help doesn’t count they’re just telling u whatever u want to hear listen to me my unprofessional opinion is better

Since discovering I’m kin with these two characters, I’ve been using that cope with my mental illnesses but it’s making me doubt whether it’s real or not. It feels very real, but I don’t want to be a fake because I know copingkin is different. Do other mentally ill kin do this? Use their kin to cope after finding out they’re kin? Thanks.

fromfiction:

Mentally ill and traumatized kin often use their knowledge of their kintypes to help them cope with their illness and stress, anon. Doing so does not make you not kin. The only thing that would make you copinglink instead of kin is if you deliberately picked the characters in order to use them to cope.

queen-of-carrion:

I was in philosophy class today and the professor told us to close our eyes, then said “unicorn”.
She then told us to open our eyes and asked what first popped into our heads.

Most of us pictured a white unicorn (i pictured the one from those Ice Breakers commercials lol).
But this one guy across the room from me said he didn’t picture a unicorn at all.

He said that he felt a unicorn horn atop his head. In all seriousness.
A phantom horn.

The rest of the class just kind of giggled and moved on, but I sat there smiling to myself for a while after that .

Nonhuman phantom sensations are not limited to otherkin.

It was super great to see that in action today! You always see people saying that but I hardly ever see someone mention it outside the context of otherkin.